BY DESIGN : Q&A; : David Bailey : Image Maker
David Bailey is one of England’s most famous photographers. He inspired Michelangelo Antonioni’s 1966 film “Blowup,” courted a string of model girlfriends (among them Jean Shrimpton and Penelope Tree) and wed four glamorous women--including actress Catherine Deneuve. He helped revolutionize Britain’s staid fashion photography, ushering in the Swinging ‘60s. In his UK/LA 1994 Festival photography show at Santa Monica College (through Oct. 8) are gritty portraits of famous people, including Jack Nicholson, who is godfather to Bailey’s son, Fenton. Bailey, 56, talked with writer Maureen Sajbel about work, friends and his reputation for biting the hand that once fed him.
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Question: In the late ‘50s, when you started, is it correct to say that fashion photography was more like the picture we had in the film “Funny Face”--Avedon, aloof models and tripods?
Answer: Yeah, more or less. It wasn’t true in America, but in England, all the top photographers, apart from (Norman) Parkinson, were gay. Theirs was a homosexual view of women, ours was a heterosexual view of women. I’m not saying one was better than the other; it’s just a different view. We were people photographing girls who wanted to sleep with them rather than ones who wanted to look like them.
Q: One of the only images we have now of your era is Antonioni’s film “Blowup.” How accurate was that?
A: Not very, really.
Q: The photographer in it was dismissive of the models. How accurate was that?
A: It’s not a true picture. The more you fall in love with the girl, the more she’s going to give to the camera.
Q: What do you think of models today?
A: I’ve only got one who’s a friend, Christy Turlington. I don’t even know the others. I love the way Christy looks and I love the way she is. She’s not full of herself.
Q: Do you pay attention to current fashion photography?
A: I can’t take things too seriously, especially fashion photography. I can’t bear those megalomaniacs who think they’re geniuses because they take a few snaps. Fashion is superficial. Every now and then a fashion picture transcends being a fashion picture and becomes a bit more interesting. But very few. A (Irving) Penn or (Richard) Avedon. The most it can be is a social document.
Q: What about the current look of magazines?
A: All the fashion magazines I’ve seen recently have been about the ‘70s. It’s silly. I always think photographers should take pictures in their own time. I see no merit in doing something that’s been done before unless you bring something new to it. What they’re doing now is not as good as Helmut Newton.
Q: What would you say to an aspiring fashion photographer today?
A: Do videos.
Q: Skip still photos altogether?
A: I think the still thing is gone on the fashion level. They don’t really want those pictures. They want to show the frocks. They want turnover. It’s disposable. The interesting thing is videos. I think lots of people who are video-makers now, like David Fincher (director of the new “Love Is Strong” video in which the Rolling Stones are giants roaming New York City), would have been fashion photographers in the ‘60s.
Q: In everything written about you, there’s very little that praises your deep understanding of fashion. You never cared much about the clothes?
A: Not much. It was what was in the clothes that I found interesting. An amusing little pleat never made a big impression. I liked Balenciaga and Saint Laurent and Mme. Gres because I thought they were artists. I’m the one who turned Catherine Deneuve on to Saint Laurent. I hated the way she dressed.
Q: What did she think of the way you dressed?
A: I didn’t ask her. I’ve always dressed the same. Jeans in summer. Corduroys in winter. This is my first pair of black jeans. I read that (entertainment mogul and activist) David Geffen wore them, so I thought if they’re good enough for David Geffen, they’re good enough for me.
Q: Why did you start with fashion?
A: I was just a kid taking pictures. I didn’t mean it to be fashion. When I was about 20 years old, Vogue offered me a contract. Then you get trapped in it. It took me about 10 years to get away from fashion.
Q: What turned you off?
A: It’s quite boring. All that waiting around I can’t bear.
Q: What would lure you back?
A: If Vogue says “will you do a special thing with Julia Roberts?” I’d say yes. It’s got to be more than a girl standing against some palm trees.
Q: What came after fashion?
A: From the late ‘60s onward I directed commercials, mostly beauty commercials. In the late ‘60s, early ‘70s I did documentaries. Then gradually more advertising. Now, primarily commercials and films for television. I just did a film with Juliet Stevenson for Channel 4, an (English) arts channel.
I’m doing a new book with my wife (the former Catherine Dyer, mother of his three young children) that’s also going to be a film and an exhibition. There’ll be a bit of fashion in this one. It’s called “The Lady Is a Tramp,” after the Rodgers and Hart song. Fay Weldon is writing it and it comes out May 1st. I just shot a video with Catherine Deneuve for Malcolm McLaren’s new record “Paris Paris.” There are two versions--a sexy version for Europe and a not-so-sexy one for England.
Q: Which version does America get?
A: They’ll probably have to have the English version.
Q: Have you had negative reactions to your work?
A: All my life.
Q: Your S & M bondage series (a controversial exhibit titled “Nudes 1981-1984”) created a furor.
A: It wasn’t about bondage at all, just the opposite in fact, about the awful way women are used. It was influenced by (Jesus’) shroud and by a picture done in 1938 by Bravo, the Mexican photographer.
Q: Are you doing any of this sexually provocative work today?
A: No. And by the way, all my ex-wives are all my best friends. All the women I’ve been with have been strong like granite. This thing about Bailey being chauvinistic is not true. I like tough, independent women.
My fashion photographs are more like portraits of women in clothes. I liked the peculiar girls. I hated the generic model who came with a big bag and had blue eyes and blond hair. I preferred Anjelica Huston and Marisa Berenson and Penelope Tree. Tough cookies. That’s why I like them.
Q: You’ve said you liked fashion only because that’s where the girls were. But now in your exhibition of portraits, it looks like you prefer shooting the gritty, unshaven faces of men, like Jack Nicholson.
A: I know this is chauvinistic, but I always feel guilty if I don’t make women look good. I feel women want to look good, except for a few extreme feminists who don’t know what they really want anyway. Maybe it’s me being wrong, but with men, I feel you can go for it. I don’t mind if I get a pimple on the end of their noses.
Q: Did the students at the opening (of the UK/LA 1994 Festival) ask you about breaking into the business?
A: You have to tell them it’s easy, otherwise they don’t like you. If you tell them it’s hard and only one in a million is going to make it, then they think you’re not very nice.
Q: “Blowup” launched a thousand photographers.
A: It was nice when “Shampoo” came along. Then they all wanted to be hairdressers.
