Argument Rages Whether State Should Try McVeigh, Nichols

Later this winter, the final design plans will be approved for a new federal office complex in Oklahoma City, a sign of rebirth and commitment that life goes on after the bombing here nearly three years ago.

But the real healing cannot begin until a raging debate is settled: Should the state proceed with the prosecution of Timothy J. McVeigh and Terry L. Nichols?

Many here who favored vigorous prosecution of the two men immediately after the blast now believe last year’s federal court convictions were enough and that the state should drop the matter.

In their view, a state trial would be too expensive, eating up perhaps as much as $10 million that could go instead to improvements in their state. Besides, they say, the trial would stand in the way of healing for scores of victims.

Many others here do not agree. For them, the Nichols trial in particular fanned theories suggesting that other conspirators remain at large, despite an exhaustive federal investigation.

Also, some say, state convictions would ensure punishment of the two men if their federal convictions were overturned on appeal.

“This has been a bumpy road to justice, and it’s now going to take another trip through Oklahoma City,” said Paul Heath, a Veterans Affairs Department psychologist injured in the April 19, 1995, blast who thinks it’s time to move on “with our own futures and not let this continue to consume us.”

Other victims’ feelings are even stronger. Bud Welch lost his daughter, 23-year-old Julie, in the bombing. But he nevertheless said taxpayers’ money would be wasted on a state trial--money he and others insist could be better spent building new roads, bridges, hospitals and schools.

“I don’t want them tried in state court,” Welch said of McVeigh and Nichols. “I just want it to be over with.”

He criticized a county grand jury that continues to investigate whether others got away with helping McVeigh and Nichols, and even whether the federal government had a role in the bombing--as some anti-government zealots have claimed and federal officials have vehemently denied.

“It’s a joke,” Welch said of the grand jury probe. “It’s not headed anyplace. It’s ridiculous.”

McVeigh was convicted on all 11 counts, including the murders of eight federal law enforcement officers, in the federal indictment against him and was sentenced to death.

Nichols was found guilty of conspiring with McVeigh and of involuntary manslaughter in the deaths of the eight federal agents killed in the blast. He escaped a death sentence and faces a maximum penalty of life in prison.

Before the Nichols trial ended, so many here expected to find him on death row that some elected officials openly questioned the wisdom of spending state money retrying both men.

But now the dynamics have changed. No politician, particularly not in an election year, wants to come out against a state trial that could bring the death penalty for Nichols.

For instance, Gov. Frank Keating, a former high-ranking federal law enforcement officer, had praised the federal investigation and prosecution of McVeigh and Nichols. He had said it was unlikely that others were involved.

But after hearing the Nichols verdict, Keating quickly embraced plans for a joint McVeigh-Nichols trial in state court.

Oklahoma County Dist. Atty. Robert Macy, a popular longtime official, has many people here behind his plan to file state charges this spring and try the pair simultaneously, but before separate juries, this fall.

“We have a responsibility under Oklahoma law to try these individuals, and I think we can get a fair trial here,” Macy said. “Whoever did this should be executed. Whoever participated in this should be executed.”

The bombing of the Alfred P. Murrah federal building killed 168 people, including the eight federal agents. The 160 civilian deaths were beyond the reach of the federal court but could be the subject of a state trial. Macy has threatened to try McVeigh and Nichols 160 times if that is what it takes to get a death sentence for both.

A state trial would be a “safety net” should the federal convictions be overturned, Macy said. He also noted that the appeals process is shorter in state court than in the federal system.

Since the death penalty was reactivated in America two decades ago, Oklahoma has executed six people--all in the last three years. The federal government has yet to carry out a death sentence.

Already, the state Legislature has appropriated $875,000 for Macy’s office to start prosecution.

“There is no intention on our part of trying to kill these guys twice,” said Macy’s assistant, Richard Wintory. “We just want to make sure they are executed at least once.”

Detractors call it a fool’s errand.

Stephen Jones, McVeigh’s defense lawyer in the federal trial, said it could cost at least $5 million--perhaps as much as $10 million--to pay for Oklahoma justice, including reinvestigation, trials, appeals and executions.

Jones, a onetime Republican candidate for the U.S. Senate from Oklahoma, also said that no state official is about to question the wisdom of a state trial. “They all want to get reelected,” he said.

Even if the men are convicted, Jones speculated, it is very likely the federal appeals court would throw out any verdict because that same court moved the federal trial to Denver out of concern that an Oklahoma jury could not give McVeigh and Nichols a fair trial.

But Wintory countered that an Oklahoma jury can be impartial today. “Time has made a significant difference,” he said. “People’s lives have moved forward.”

The grand jury process is another matter.

That panel began its investigation early last year and has heard from scores of people who said they saw others with McVeigh or have other reasons to discount Washington’s conclusion that McVeigh and Nichols were the only people responsible.

“Since the day of the bombing,” said government spokeswoman Chris Watney, “the FBI has spent countless hours pursuing leads that included more than 30,000 witness interviews and an extensive review of thousands of pieces of forensic and other evidence in the case.

“That investigation led to two people: Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols. The investigation is now closed, but the government remains prepared to follow any credible lead that may serve to resolve any unanswered questions in the case.”

The only conspirators the FBI unearthed were Michael and Lori Fortier, the husband and wife who were aware of the bomb plot and testified in Denver as government witnesses.

Nevertheless, the Nichols verdict gave new wings to conspiracy buffs. The jury forewoman, Niki Deutchman, said she and others on the panel believe that McVeigh and Nichols had help.

Also, a defense witness, Carol Howe, testified in the Nichols case that she saw McVeigh at Elohim City, an anti-government compound in eastern Oklahoma, before the bombing. That testimony could be seen as an indication others at the compound may have been involved.

So the debate continues, and the wounds fester in Oklahoma.

“We are not after vengeance,” said Diane Leonard, whose husband, Secret Service Agent Donald Leonard, was among the eight slain federal agents. “We are not a vengeful people. But we absolutely are after justice.

“And there are 160 murder cases that have not yet been brought to trial.”

But Welch compared the push for a state trial to what is happening in Sacramento, where, he said, federal prosecutors want the death penalty for accused Unabomber Theodore J. Kaczynski even though his lawyers sought a plea bargain for a life sentence.

“He’s obviously a nut, but the politicians in Washington don’t want a life sentence; they want the death penalty,” Welch said.

“The same is happening here. Unfortunately, politics and the justice system in America intertwine. They shouldn’t, but they do.”