Live chat: good fats, bad fats

2007-07-23 15:57:56.0 Administrator2: Hello and welcome to the Health chat with nutrition expert Susan Bowerman! We’ll be starting in just a few minutes, so feel free to submit your questions now! You’ll see them appear in the chat window once we begin.

2007-07-23 16:00:57.0 Administrator2: Okay, let’s go. The subject of this chat is Good fats, bad fats. There has been so much in the news about all this: it’s a confusing topic. Here’s our first question:

2007-07-23 16:00:59.0 peter Howden: Hi, what oils have trans fats?

2007-07-23 16:01:18.0 Administrator2: take it away...Susan!

2007-07-23 16:01:44.0 Susan Bowerman: Dear Peter, Trans fats are not found to any great extent naturally in foods. They are produced when oils are converted into harder fats, which makes them more useful for baking....

2007-07-23 16:02:16.0 Susan Bowerman: So for instance, trans fats are frequently found in things like commerically prepared crackers, cookies, etc., as well as margarines that began as oils.

2007-07-23 16:02:56.0 Susan Bowerman: Now that manufacturers are are taking trans fats out of foods, in some cases they are replacing them with saturated fats, which are also not very heart-healthy.

2007-07-23 16:03:04.0 Courtney: What is so bad about trans fats? There is a lot of talk of them these days, but aren’t they just the same as other bad fats?

2007-07-23 16:03:48.0 Susan Bowerman: Trans fats are roughly equivalent to saturated fats in terms of their negative effects on cholesterol. They raise total cholesterol and lower the HDL, or good, cholesterol.

2007-07-23 16:04:15.0 Administrator2: Are trans worse than saturated?

2007-07-23 16:04:51.0 Susan Bowerman: There are some studies that suggest that they may be worse, but we tend to consume more saturated fats in the total diet.

2007-07-23 16:04:56.0 Administrator2: It seems one can avoid trans fats pretty easily with store food because of the labeling. But what about restaurants?

2007-07-23 16:05:54.0 Susan Bowerman: Yes, there is a big push for restaurants to remove trans fats from their foods. It’s interesting, because now that there has been a push, many of the large chains seem to have been able to do this rather effectively. So, it may be a good thing that we push for these changes in our foods.

2007-07-23 16:06:27.0 Administrator2: But if saturated fats are also bad, and also more common, are we focusing too much attention on trans?

2007-07-23 16:07:22.0 Susan Bowerman: I think we may be. My advice is to try to reduce fats to a reasonably low level, and to try to consume the more healthy oils. It’s not as difficult as it seems, but it does require some diligence with label reading, careful selections when you go out, and a bit more attention at home when you cook and bake.

2007-07-23 16:07:29.0 Administrator2: Here’s another trans fat question from Riley:

2007-07-23 16:07:31.0 Riley: I was looking at the FDA site which indicated hamburger has substantial trans fat, almost 1 gm/4oz serving--it that natural?

2007-07-23 16:08:20.0 Susan Bowerman: This may have been an entire hamburger sandwich. There could be some trans fat in the bun, for instance. There may also be trans fats in processed cheese, which may be included in the calculation.

2007-07-23 16:08:35.0 Courtney: How much “good fat” should we eat a day?

2007-07-23 16:09:46.0 Susan Bowerman: It’s hard to put an exact number on how much each person should eat, since fat recommendations really should looked at as a percentage of total calories, which varies per individual...

2007-07-23 16:11:02.0 Susan Bowerman: But, in general, a diet with about 25% of calories from fat is very do-able, and very palatable. It means not eating a lot of baked goods, avoiding fried items, and rich dressings and sauces, but still allows small amounts for healthy olive oil vinaigrettes, for example, or for sauteeing in a bit of oil, or sprinkling some nuts or avocado on a dish.

2007-07-23 16:11:36.0 Administrator2: What are the fats we would classify as good?

2007-07-23 16:12:43.0 Susan Bowerman: The fat we obtain from consuming ocean-caught fish is some of the healthiest oil you can consume. Unfortunately, we don’t eat enough fish in the US. Fish is rich in omega-3 fatty acids, which are known to be anti-inflammatory and may help protect us against many degenerative diseases of aging....

2007-07-23 16:13:35.0 Susan Bowerman: After fish oil, olive oil is very heart-healthy. It is rich in omega-9 fatty acids, which do not raise cholesterol levels, and appear to help raise HDL cholesterol. The fat we obtain naturally from avocado and tree nuts is also healthy for us.

2007-07-23 16:14:30.0 Administrator2: What about corn oil, soy oil, those “grain” oils that we consume a lot of in this country?

2007-07-23 16:15:22.0 Susan Bowerman: The problem with these oils is that they are rich in omega-6 fatty acids, which, when they overshadow the omega 3’s in the diet can cause problems....

2007-07-23 16:16:07.0 Susan Bowerman: Omega-3 and omega-6 fats compete for metabolism in the body, and when we the system is overwhelmed by a large amount of omega-6 from corn oil, for instance, the end products of metabolizing the omega-6 fats are pro-inflammatory.

2007-07-23 16:17:00.0 Susan Bowerman: So, we need to rebalance these fats. Interestingly, the balance of omega 3 to omega 6 in corn itself is reasonably good, but when the corn is processed into oil, much of the omega-3 is stripped away. We often forget that traces of fat exist naturally in many of our foods, often in the best balance that nature intended.

2007-07-23 16:17:07.0 Brian_K: how about fat from nuts?

2007-07-23 16:18:10.0 Susan Bowerman: Tree nuts are healthy for us, in that they are rich in monounsaturated fatty acids which help to keep HDL levels up. One caveat is that peanuts are not nuts, they’re beans - and so while peanuts themselves might be okay to eat, peanut oil has similar problems to the corn oil once it’s been processed.

2007-07-23 16:18:19.0 Courtney: does the “farm raised” fish have the omega-3’s? or should i spend the extra $ on wild fish?

2007-07-23 16:18:59.0 Susan Bowerman: Farm raised and ocean caught fish generally have about the same amount of omega-3; BUT, the farmed fish are fattier - it makes them larger and heavier and the farmers can make more money....

2007-07-23 16:19:42.0 Susan Bowerman: But, that extra fat on the farmed fish is not omega-3, it’s omega-6. The farmed fish are eating a diet of grains, rather than the natural smaller fish or algae they eat in the ocean. So, I would suggest that you buy wild whenever possible.

2007-07-23 16:19:52.0 leo: Thank you, I like squid very much. I always believed I was making a low fat choice. Now I’ve noticed that squid is very high in cholesterol. i don’t understand?

2007-07-23 16:21:09.0 Susan Bowerman: A serving of squid has about as much cholesterol as an extra-large egg. It is higher than other seafood, but it makes me wonder if this might be old data. We used to think shrimp and crab were high in cholesterol, but newer data tells us that those numbers were incorrect....

2007-07-23 16:22:20.0 Susan Bowerman: It turns out that with the shrimp, what was determined to be cholesterol was actually natural plant stanols that the shrimp were consuming... these are the same products that are put into cholesterol-lowering margarine. They compete with cholesterol for absorption in the digestive tract; So, years ago, the equipment was not sophisticated enough to tell the difference.

2007-07-23 16:23:10.0 Susan Bowerman: It may be the same case with squid. But, if the cholesterol level is at around 300 mg per serving, keep in mind that what drives blood cholesterol up is more the saturated fats and trans fats in foods that are a problem, rather than dietary cholesterol.

2007-07-23 16:24:14.0 Administrator2: Susan, we have a follow-up remark from Riley, about the trans fat levels in hamburger...he says the ground meat alone has trans fat in it. Could you address that?

2007-07-23 16:26:24.0 Susan Bowerman: There may be some small amounts of naturally-occurring trans fats in meats that are made in the digestive tract of the animal. At this point, it’s probably safe to say that small amounts of these naturally-occurring trans fats are of less concern. I would focus more on higher amounts that are present in items like prepared cakes, cookies or doughnuts.

2007-07-23 16:26:33.0 Pixel: If I go to a restaurant, how do I find out what contains trans fats?

2007-07-23 16:26:58.0 Administrator2: Yes, are there perhaps certain foods more or less likely to contain them, on the menu? Things to select, things to avoid?

2007-07-23 16:28:10.0 Susan Bowerman: Unless the restaurant has that information available, it may be difficult to know. Some of the large chains are removing them altogether. If you are in a regular restaurant, then I would stay away, again, from bakery products like muffins, biscuits, pies, cakes, and cookies, and I would also avoid any fried foods. These are the foods that would be most likely to be made with hydrogenated (hardened) fats.

2007-07-23 16:28:57.0 Riley: Smart Balance and others claim that a university (forget which one) study show that a balance of mono- and poly-unsaturated with some saturated fat is beneficial. Considering how much saturated fat most get, is it really any better to use a product like that? I like the taste and cooking properties--it is ok to use?

2007-07-23 16:30:32.0 Susan Bowerman: Smart Balance is a trans-fat free product, and does have some monounsaturated fats in it, which most margarines do not have. So, from that standpoint, they have managed to create a product that might be slightly better than, say, regular margarine. It’s fine to use in small amounts, but don’t make the assumption that if ‘some is good, more is better’.

2007-07-23 16:30:54.0 Riley: 25% Calories from fat seems pretty low for a mostly “good fat”intake, especially in light of the benefits of Mediterranean type diets. Isn’’t a higher percentage better?

2007-07-23 16:32:10.0 Susan Bowerman: I don’t see any reason to push the percentage higher. For one thing, I do think that 25% of calories is very palatable - not a spartan diet at all. Secondly, when you consume a mediterranean type of diet, which approaches nearly 40% of calories from fat, it takes calories away that I believe would be better spent on fruits and vegetables.

2007-07-23 16:33:01.0 Administrator2: Susan, we have a question from Anne about sources for determining good and bad fat contents in foods.....

2007-07-23 16:33:03.0 Anne: Is there an easy source to determine good fat from harmful fat. For instance, I just know was told that shrimp and other shellfish are high in cholesterol. I need a cheat sheet! Thank you.

2007-07-23 16:34:15.0 Susan Bowerman: Anne, the USDA maintains a comprehensive database of the nutritional content of foods, and you should be able to get this information from them. As I mentioned above, and I think you joined in late, shrimp and shellfish are actually not high in cholesterol, and are perfectly fine to eat, even if your blood cholesterol level is high.

2007-07-23 16:34:50.0 Administrator2: Susan, wnat do you think of those very low fat diets --like Pritikin?

2007-07-23 16:36:11.0 Susan Bowerman: The biggest problem with these very low fat diets is that they are difficult to follow. Basically, there are no added fats in these diets whatsoever. I’m not opposed to them, if individuals want to follow them, because generally you can obtain enough essential fatty acids from whole foods, even if you have no added fats. But, people on these diets have trouble eating in restaurants, and unless the whole family is on the plan, it can be difficult to stick with.

2007-07-23 16:36:57.0 Administrator2: We have a question from Lindsay, who works here at the la times web. She is a vegan. ..and her question is...

2007-07-23 16:37:24.0 Administrator2: “Since most of the saturated fats appear to come from animal products, do vegans not have to worry about good and bad fats?”

2007-07-23 16:38:32.0 Susan Bowerman: Actually, yes. Saturated fats do primarily come from animal products, but there are some saturated vegetable fats, too, like coconut oil and palm oil. Also, since oils can be converted into more saturated fats (i.e., margarine is vegan), you can still pick up some saturated fats in foods even if you don’t eat any animal products or by-products.

2007-07-23 16:39:01.0 Administrator2: And then thre’s the omega 6 thing too, right? Too much corn oil?

2007-07-23 16:39:47.0 Susan Bowerman: Yes, that’s potentially an issue. There is actually one study that I recently looked at that discussed just this issue. Since vegans don’t eat fish, they often rely on flaxseed to supply omega-3 fatty acids....

2007-07-23 16:40:25.0 Susan Bowerman: Flax does have omega-3 fatty acids, but they are not identical to the more beneficial omega-3’s in fish, and our bodies are not particularly efficient at converting the flax fatty acids into the more beneficial ones.

2007-07-23 16:40:49.0 Administrator2: Thanks Susan. Anyone who’s got a question, please feel free to submit it now...

2007-07-23 16:41:26.0 Administrator2: Going once.....

2007-07-23 16:41:38.0 Administrator2: Oh! Wait! I have one!

2007-07-23 16:42:05.0 Administrator2: What’s all this I’ve been reading about the healthful effects of coconut oil? Will it make me live longer?

2007-07-23 16:43:12.0 Susan Bowerman: There is a lot of interest lately in coconut oil. I think part of this is in response to the trans fat issue - that much of the trans fat in the diet came from ‘unnatural’ sources, like manufactured margarines, so there seems to be this belief that perhaps more ‘natural’ fats might be better for us....

2007-07-23 16:44:11.0 Susan Bowerman: Coconut fat is highly saturated, though, and so it isn’t something that I would recommend in large amounts. Remember that when you consume the fat in the coconut flesh, that’s one thing... but when you add a concentrated source to the diet and use it as an added fat, it puts the natural balance out of of whack again, possibly....

2007-07-23 16:45:29.0 Susan Bowerman: I think if you want to use a little bit for flavor that’s fine. There are no really good clinical studies on this in humans, and most of the studies are population studies - i.e., they may state that populations where a lot of coconut oil is consumed are healthier. But there’s no way to know if it’s the coconut oil, or something else in the diet that may be providing the benefit.

2007-07-23 16:45:55.0 Administrator2: The health section recently ran an little “Ask Us” on the topic of coconut oil. You can read it at...

2007-07-23 16:45:58.0 Administrator2: https://www.latimes.com/features/health/la-hew-askus25jun25,1,2736631.story?coll=la-headlines-health&ctrack=3&cset=true

2007-07-23 16:46:07.0 bruin bub: I’m curious about the role of saturated fat. I’ve read that a high percentage of it surrounds the heart, but I’ve also read that the saturated fat you consume stays in your body, can you explain saturated fat’s role?

2007-07-23 16:47:59.0 Susan Bowerman: The fat that you consume in the diet is reflected in your body’s tissues. We know for example, that in people who consume higher amounts of polyunsaturated omega-3 fatty acids, the levels of these fatty acids in their cell membranes will be higher. In fact, we can actually predict what the fatty acids in the cells will be based on what is in the diet.

2007-07-23 16:49:03.0 Administrator2: Maybe bruin bub’s talking about the difference between visceral fat, which surrounds the body organs, and subcutaneous fat. I have heard that visceral fat is worse, linked to heart disease and diabetes?

2007-07-23 16:50:09.0 Susan Bowerman: Yes, visceral fat is considerably worse. Basically, this is ‘deep’ fat (unlike the subcutaneous fat that is right under the skin). This fat originally was there when we were cavemen to provide some fat storage, but it also helped ancient humans fight infection....

2007-07-23 16:52:05.0 Susan Bowerman: This visceral fat produces inflammatory substances, which would have been beneficial in an acute situation to help the body fight infection, for example. But, now that we have a lot of people with excess visceral fat, this system is sort of turned onto a low simmer all the time. Too much visceral fat means that we are always putting out these hormones, which produce chronic low grade inflammation (part of the immune response) which we believe may contribute to the pathogenesis of some cancers, heart disease, Alzheimer’s disease, arthritis and other inflammatory diseases.

2007-07-23 16:52:22.0 Administrator2: How does one get rid of it?

2007-07-23 16:53:21.0 Susan Bowerman: The good news is that visceral fat is more easily lost than the more stubborn hip and thigh fat. With diligent efforts in exercise and weight loss, this is usually the first fat to go. This also means that we see big improvements in the markers of inflammation with weight loss relatively quickly.

2007-07-23 16:53:41.0 Administrator2: Well thank heavens for that. We are about out of time now...

2007-07-23 16:53:48.0 Anne: Are we able to print this?

2007-07-23 16:54:19.0 Administrator2: Why yes, Anne, you will be able to print the transcript of this chat. It should be loaded up onto the health web site ..

2007-07-23 16:54:51.0 Administrator2: ..either early this evening or tomorrow morning. email health@latimes.com if you have trouble finding it.

2007-07-23 16:55:18.0 Administrator2: Thanks Susan! Very interesting chat. And thanks everybody for participating.

2007-07-23 16:55:38.0 Susan Bowerman: Thanks for having me. Look forward to the next chat.

2007-07-23 16:56:10.0 Administrator2: The next nutrition chat will be on August 16 at 4 pm. Come back then!