ERIC SHOW Q & A : Whether the Subject Is Politics or Pitching, the Man Is a Puzzle

When this interview began, Eric Show was eating a peanut butter sandwich. It took place in Pittsburgh, where the Padres played two games earlier this week. When it ended an hour or so later, Show had elaborated on his nutty baseball life. Why is he booed--sometimes viciously--during home games? Why in the past have his relationships with teammates been strained? Does he dream at night about Pete Rose and that record-breaking hit? Did he really break his toe last year kicking a bat rack? What? Dick Williams reminded him of his father? Why has he been avoiding interviews this season? Is his affiliation with the John Birch Society the root of his image problem?

Here is probably the most misunderstood San Diego Padre, and perhaps the most misunderstood athlete in San Diego.

QUESTION: Well, Eric. You have obtained sort of a nasty reputation. . . . The local broadcasters here, for example. You’re driving down the road, and a radio guy says, “Eric (Longball) Show is pitching tonight.” Is it fair that you’ve obtained this label? Was it off one game?

ANSWER: Well, the first thing is, I think, that the home run is a dramatic event in a ballgame. And, when you combine that with the fact I’ve been very outspoken in a lot of different issues. . . . And--as a parenthesis to that, too--whenever you are outspoken, dogmatic about certain issues, you’ll alienate a certain percentage of the population automatically, no matter which side you’re on, no matter what you say. And that, also combined with some of the inflammatory remarks I have made toward certain newscasters and certain radio personalities, makes me a target, and some of it’s my fault.

Now, I’m not saying that I never give up home runs, but what I am saying is that in the overall evaluation of my performance as a major league baseball player, I think that it is obvious that if you were to dwell on one of my negative statistics such as home runs, to try to plead a case that I either don’t deserve to pitch in the big leagues or that I’m even deserving of a nickname that would somehow put emphasis on a negative stat is unfair to say the very least. When you consider my ERA, my won-loss record over a period of years, criticism because of home runs would be unwarranted, unless your intent is to make me look bad.

Q: You think people tend to want to make you look bad?

A: No, I just think it’s very safe.

Q: What do you mean?

A: Well, Eric Show is very outspoken. Eric Show is very mysterious at times. I don’t have PR agencies promoting me. I shun interviews, usually. I shun talking to people because I’d rather remain just about unnoticed if I could. But because of my outspoken past, I think I have sort of made it tough on myself a little bit, too.

Q: What about this outspoken past? What happened?

A: Well, I actually, I think, was a pretty popular character in San Diego for a long time. People found my other interests fascinating. I was successful in baseball, and it was before the (1984) playoffs when I probably got the home run reputation. And I did have a disastrous playoff. I’m not gonna deny that at all. I would say in all fairness, though, that I did make a contribution to the club that year. . . . But I was quite a popular character before I started to get dogmatic on certain issues. I’m even more popular now with certain segments of the population, and I’m largely a lot less popular with other segments of the population. Before, I was basically just sort of a kick. The jazz guitar, the intellectual type stuff. All these things, they thought were all cute. But when I got really serious about certain subjects, suddenly it became a . . . well it became taboo in a way--no that’s the right word. It just became . . . Anytime you’re dogmatic or outspoken, you’re going to alienate a good percentage of the population, especially if you, in my opinion, espouse traditional American values and sort of conservative positions on things.

Q: Was it the whole John Birch thing that started this? Or was it way before that?

A: I don’t know.

Q: When you say you’re outspoken . . .

A: Well, it’s all sorts of things. It’s not just politics. It’s God.

Q: What’s wrong with that?

A: Well, you see, I’ve chosen a specific God. Say Jesus Christ. And I respect all different religions. I do feel there is one truth. However, I’m very tolerant of all kinds of ideas. I always have been. Anybody who knows me knows I’m extremely open-minded, but I’m very tolerant. That doesn’t mean that I believe all of them or think they’re all equally valid.

Q: Well, what are your feelings on religion?

A: People, in general, don’t like the word ‘religion.’ You know (laughing), I remember how I used to shy away from it when I was younger. Religion is like--wow--code of ethics, certain behavior, wear black all the time and look down at the ground (again, laughing). You know, women wear long dresses down to the ground. And, to a degree, that is still true today. Whereas I look at it entirely differently.

Q: How?

A: Well, I look at it like God does exist, that God is in the person of Jesus Christ, and a great Triune Godhead of a Trinity, and that all life is meant to be exciting and wonderful and that we can have a personal relationship with God by how he’s granted us to have a relationship with him, and not fear him all the time and walk around like we’re always defeated.

Q: Why does this philosophy create a problem for you publicly?

A: I don’t know. I think the real question there is human nature.

Q: That’s another thing . . . Human nature doesn’t like someone maybe who is brighter, right? And some people--teammates perhaps--may resent you for your brains?

A: (laughing) I’ve burned a little midnight oil.

Q: Tell me about that? How serious a student were you?

A: Oh, I wasn’t a serious student at all when I was in college. That’s why I changed my major three times. However, my coach still tells the story to this day that I had to virtually learn an entire quarter of chemistry one time in about a week because I hadn’t been to class very much. I was playing music at night and baseball during the day. So you combine that with all my activities, and there isn’t a whole lot of time left if you want to sleep and eat. So I wasn’t a very good student, or very dedicated. But I had the ability to pick up on things very quickly.

Q: What did you major in first?

A: I was a pre-med student.

Q: And then?

A: Biology. And then I was undeclared.

Q: How’d you end up in physics?

A: That’s what I decided I liked the best. It was just something that interested me the most. I thought physics and philosophy would give me a real handle on reality. In other words, with physics I could know how the physical world operated. And with philosophy, I could know how the interpretation of that reality operated. And, between the two, I thought I could get the best picture of what this is all about. And I think that education is an end in itself and not a means to an end.

Q: And, yet, you can’t sit there and have many conversations with some of the ballplayers (he laughs) . . . I’m being serious. You’re not one of these guys who sits down and talks philosophy or physics with his teammates?

A: No. . . . No. . . . Because there’d be no point in it.

Q: Does it then make it sometimes hard to be close . . . Well, you’re close to some players, but you aren’t with others, are you?

A: I think I’m closer now than I’ve ever been with all of them. Because a lot of misunderstandings have been straightened out over the years. And you grow with them and learn to like each other a little better. But what I have to do--on a fairly regular basis--is keep contact with some of my outside friends . . . so that I can appreciate the fact that there are people out there who are like me. I just don’t find them in baseball. There are people out there who are so immensely intense that it’s a real privilege to be with them. . . . You know, most people will take your time, a few will share your time, but when you get together with someone who really adds to your time, it’s a real treat.

Q: Do baseball players add to your time?

A: Well, they do, because I do not expect anything else from them except a relationship that a ballplayer can have with a ballplayer. I don’t take any unrealistic expectations into anything anymore.

Q: Do you look back at the Rose record-breaking hit? What’s your perception now that a few months have passed?

A: Right now, if I had to say whether I was glad or wasn’t glad it happened, I’d have to say I’m glad it happened. But just barely.

Q: (Laughs) Just barely, huh?

A: Well (he pauses), I don’t mind surrendering a single to Pete Rose and, by chance, having it be the hit that breaks a cherished record. That doesn’t bother me too much. And I made some money off it in the off-season, too.

Q: How so?

A: Autographs. . . . And now I know Pete won’t forget me, at least.

Q: You’ll live in infamy, right?

A: Well, you know what, I honestly never think about it unless somebody asks me.

Q: I won’t bring it up again.

A: No, I mean, I don’t mind talking about it. I just never think about it. I thought what Pete did was very significant. It was awesome. But I’ve never been a real big sports fan. I can’t tell you trivia and what team did what and who did what. I wouldn’t know those things.

Q: (During the Cincinnati series in which Rose broke Ty Cobb’s record, a number of Padre players suggested it was difficult to play behind Show because of his “pouting.” Show later met with his teammates.) Tell me about the meeting you had with your teammates?

A: I felt it was something I had to do at the time because there was a severe misunderstanding about my whole approach to the game, which was partially my fault because of certain idiosyncrasies, mannerisms, and so on that I have.

Q: The alleged pouting, you mean?

A: Right. It really wasn’t pouting. What it was is that I’m very hard on myself. I always have been. I’m very, very hard on myself. Part of the problem is that a lot of these things I demand of myself, I demand of other people, too. This creates a misunderstanding a lot of times. Often times, people feel threatened. Defense mechanisms are set up. Communication is blocked. So I felt I had to go up to the team, tell them how I was feeling, tell them that if I’d done things that have either offended them, annoyed them or something else, if they’d tell me about it and help me learn too, that I would appreciate it. And, I think people began to realize I’m really just like them, at least emotionally. Which I am.

Q: We’ve all heard the booing. When did everything start to go bad this way, with the fans and players?

A: Well, it was the combination of a lot of things. (Pause) The playoffs, which were terrible, really. My performance in them wasn’t good at all. Although, people don’t remember that when I left the game, say in Chicago, I think the score was 4-0 or something, which isn’t good and I’m not proud of it, but we ended up losing 13-0. But everyone remembers me, because I was the first pitcher to start the first playoff game for San Diego. It was a big thing. . . . So that was part of it. I think also the fact that my outspoken nature in the past made me a candidate (for booing). But one thing I’d like to say is that I don’t begrudge a fan’s right to boo. And, also, I’ve heard every player on our team, without exception, get booed at one time or another.

Q: Yeah. Goose Gossage included.

A: Oh yeah. Garvey, too. So I’ve heard that. Maybe they haven’t been as resounding for them as for some other players, but they’ve been there. So I would have to say that the only thing that might upset me about boos is how premature they are at times. I could never see myself booing a Steve Carlton, for example, but he’s been booed, too. So fans have a right to boo. My only objection would be that sometimes they boo a little prematurely and don’t consider what this person has done in the past. You can’t be perfect every night.

Q: Do you think the media’s treatment of you has been fair? I don’t. And I’ve been guilty of it, too. That’s on the record.

A: (laughing). No, I don’t. But I think I haven’t done all I could, though, to help create a better understanding, either. I know I don’t feel I’ve been treated fairly, but I don’t necessarily think it was a conspiracy on me. I think, as far as my politics, it may have been conspiratorial, because I was considered such a radical.

Q: Are you a radical?

A: No. Well, radical comes from . . . Well, in math there’s a radical sign, which denotes the square root. Radical really means to the root. So if you consider that a person wants to get at the root of truth, then I’m a radical. The problem with that is that, today, it’s an inflammatory word, and people have taken it out of context. And out of connotation, radical is extreme right or extreme left. I am neither.

Q: Do you regret that the Birch thing ever came out?

A: Well, I guess I’ll have to get philosophical, really, to answer as best I could. And that is, everything happens for a reason. And I try not to think about things in the past as good or bad. I just try to press on. And that’s wisdom. You live and learn. I learn things every year and every day.

Q: In high school, you were a jock?

A: I played ball, and I loved ball. I also played in rock n’ roll bands. I played at my prom. I played at weekend concerts that would be held in the school auditorium. I was probably known more as a musician in high school than a baseball player. Except when I got a little older, by the time I was a senior and had a few stories written about me. People then got to know me as half and half. . . . But I was also real good in school in high school. I graduated with honors, which wasn’t hard to do, though (laughing). If you just show up in high school, you should be able to do pretty well. . . . I was prevented from getting involved with drugs because of my strict upbringing by my father concerning that subject. But I was wild in every other respect.

Q: What’s wild?

A: Well, I would go where I wanted to go on weekends and do what I wanted to do within reason. And I liked to have a good time.

Q: What’s a good time?

A: I think most of us know what a good time was in high school (laughing). It’s not what I consider a good time now, let’s put it that way (laughing).

Q: What about your dad? His influence on you?

A: My dad was great for me. He always pushed me. An outside observer would probably say he was too hard on me, and at times, he was.

Q: A description?

A: Sure. In school, if I didn’t come home with A’s, he would take away my record player and my guitars and everything I liked and made me be at home when he came home from work, at which time he’d take me out and make me play catch. Then make me return to do homework. In a way, he lived his life through me, too. But I’m eternally grateful for that. If it wasn’t for his influence in my life, I’m sure I would not be playing major league baseball. Just no way. I had my head in many, many different directions, and baseball really was not one of them.

Q: Was he the most influential person in your life?

A: In terms of baseball, I’d have to say so.

Q: How’d you get started with music?

A: The Beatles in 1964. . . . And then I played rock ‘n roll until I was about 19. And then I started playing jazz. And then I started playing real strict straight-ahead jazz for about the last seven years.

Q: And you bring your guitar with you on the road?

A: Yeah. In fact, I was just playing last night with the band here in the hotel (in Pittsburgh).

Q: Is it a form of relaxation for you?

A: It’s just a form of expression. I really don’t play guitar as much as I used to. I used to put in 3 to 5 hours a day. . . . By the time I got to the majors, probably a couple hours a day. Now, it’s down to probably a couple hours every three or four days. At home, a little more.

Q: What about Cara Mia, your wife? Her influence on you?

A: She doesn’t like baseball. She probably would be happier if I did something else for a living. When she reads something bad about me, she takes it harder than I do. And that makes it rough on me, when I see that she takes things hard. But, by the same token, it’s good, because she has so many other characteristics, and that’s important. When I’m done playing the game I don’t want to think about baseball anymore. And she really helps in that respect.

Q: What did she do after you gave up Rose’s hit?

A: Actually, she kind of laughed about it. She felt for me, while the festivities were going on. But, to her, it’s kind of funny how people get so involved in baseball. . . . But see, I came from a baseball family. I know why. She didn’t.

Q: You have shied away from the media this year. Why?

A: I just felt that the more I really tried to get a point across and the more precise I tried to be and the more in depth I went into an issue, the greater probability of misquoting or misconstruing or covering up what I said took place. And sometimes I’d stick my own foot in my mouth and say something I really didn’t mean. Or I meant it, but not in the way it sounded. We talked earlier about inflammatory words, like radical. What radical really means and what it’s connotation is today are really two different things. And, that is the reason I shied away. I decided, well, is it really worth it?

Q: With everything else in your life, in terms of interests and ideals, how import is baseball?

A: (Laughing) I think baseball’s very important, but in the universal scope of things and with the fact that if you measure time universally, we’re here for a brief second, no.

Q: No what?

A: No, it’s not important. However, in our lives, a 60- or 70-year life, it’s a very important game. It’s my livelihood, and it’s allowed me to meet wonderful people, make a lot of money . . .

Q: Is this how you can handle people booing you?

A: That’s a good question, because I remember being at spring training and listening to people boo Dave Winfield. I’d sit in the stands, and Winfield would look a little upset, and I remember saying to myself, ‘Gosh, if I made his money and was as good as he was, I wouldn’t care if they said anything.’ But when it happens to you and you’re there, you’re not thinking of the dollars anymore. I guess it’s just human nature. You want to be loved and you want to be accepted. And I do, too. People think I’m a machine, but I’m extremely emotional. Very sensitive. And I don’t regret it.

Q: Which would you say has been your best season?

A: I suppose, statistically, it was probably last year. But in my mind, it was my rookie year. Because of the intense excitement of playing in the big leagues, which is still there, but not like it is when you’re a rookie. And, the hopes and dreams of the future. . . . I’d say 1982.

Q: Have those hopes and dreams worn off?

A: No, but it doesn’t hit you as hard anymore, because--now--God-willing and barring anything crazy, I’m set for the rest of my life. Financially, at least. So that’s no longer a hope or a dream. . . . I’m expanding my interests . . . And the more you learn about music, the less you really get blown away. What I have to do is read a real good novel, so that I can escape every now and then.

Q: What’s your favorite book?

A: Besides the Bible? It’s a tossup between two, and this will really throw people for a loop--Gone With The Wind and Atlas Shrugged.

Q: Really? Why?

A: Gone With The Wind was the greatest romantic novel I’ve ever read. Atlas Shrugged was the greatest novel that combined romanticism with a very solidly backed-up objectivist epistemology.

Q: A little over my head. Anyway, I’m gonna give you some player’s names, and I want your reaction. . . . Dravecky?

A: (Long pause) A good man. Good man.

Q: Thurmond?

A: Good man. Really is.

Q: Garvey?

A: (Long pause) Garvey . . . I really don’t know Steve well enough to comment.

Q: Goose Gossage?

A: Goose . . . good pitcher . . . Goose is a good guy. He’s a down-home country good guy.

Q: Tim Stoddard?

A: I don’t really know Tim well enough. Maybe I really don’t know Goose well enough. Before I can make an all-out statement about somebody, maybe I have to know them well.

Q: Who do you know well, besides Thurmond and Dravecky?

A: Well, to clarify one thing, for me to be 100% sure of a character analyzation. . . . I would have to spend a lot of time with them. And I really don’t spend a lot of time with anybody on the team. Dane Iorg or Dave Dravecky or Mark Thurmond, those would be the guys I spend the most time with.

Q: Terry Kennedy?

A: Terry Kennedy and I are a lot alike emotionally. He has a lot of side interests. Him being brought up in the type of baseball family he was, though, he probably puts more pressure on himself than I do. Not more demands. But more pressure.

Q: What do you think you have to improve on the most as a pitcher?

A: Oh, there’s so many things. And that’s what gives me hope.

Q: Pitching coach Galen Cisco has said he likes the way you pitch, but that sometimes you go to the fastball a little too much. Agree?

A: Well, he’s probably right. I probably do throw the fastball too much. . . . Everything I throw is hard. And I rarely throw off-speed pitches. But I think I ought to throw more. It’s gotten me out of some tough jams.

Q: Let’s clear up a couple things. One, the story that you kicked the bat rack and broke your toe. True?

A: (Laughing) Well, I know that’s one of the things my wife laughs a lot about. She thought: ‘How can they give so much publicity to your big toe?’ And I thought it was kind of funny, too. What happened was a combination of a couple things. I did kick a bat rack. That’s a fact. But what happened was, that when I was hitting, I twisted my toe into the ground when I turned to hit a pitch. And when I did, that must have been the straw that broke the camel’s back, the catalyst having been kicking the bat rack. . . . And big controversy was created.

Q: Overblown?

A: Yeah, but a lot of things are overblown today. But I never missed a start.

Q: There was an incident in Atlanta last year when Dick Williams left you in probably too long and did so probably just to spite you. He had taken you out with a 6-1 lead against St. Louis just before that. After the team wound up losing that game, you sounded like you were questioning his move. And then he left you in against Atlanta your next start . . .

A: Well, Dick was a very sensitive man, at least about what was said about him. I was taken out (of the St. Louis game) with a 6-1 lead, and the media asked me: ‘Were you tired?’ I said no. They said: ‘You think you should’ve been taken out?’ I said no, not really. He took that as a personal cut to him. And so he just sent me a little message: ‘Be ready to go nine in Atlanta.’ It was by word of mouth. I better be ready to go nine. Fine. I want to go nine. But it was humid as hell there. Anyway, I kept us in the ballgame, and we ended up winning.”

Q: But he jeopardized a game over a personal matter, didn’t he?

A: Well, they asked me about it after the game. But Dick Williams reminded me an awful lot of my father in a lot of respects. I always kind of liked Dick, but we had our disagreements through the years. But not nearly as much as was publicized. We really didn’t argue . . .

Q: What would you tell the city of San Diego to make people understand you better?

A: Well, I suppose if I could tell them anything about myself that they may not know is that I’ve never said anything bad about them (laughing). And, that basically, I’m a grateful person who’s very happy to play baseball. I’m very tough on myself, as tough on myself as anybody’s ever been on me. And please don’t misconstrue that with pouting or giving up. Because I’ll never give up and never have.

Q: And you don’t try to give up home runs, do you?

A: No. And I will be giving up less. Mark my words.