Major League Baseball’s Winter Meetings : Dodgers, Angels Both Hopeful, but Not Optimistic About Deals

Will the Angels and Dodgers do anything more than swap tall tales this week in Texas?

Are they prepared to make the seemingly required player trades during the winter baseball meetings that open here today?

Fred Claire, executive vice president of the Dodgers, and Mike Port, his Angel counterpart, both used the same terminology: Hopeful, but not optimistic. They acknowledged that hopeful might even be something of an embellishment.

The problem is twofold:

--Each club is looking for a rare commodity.

--Each is limited in what it can offer.

The Angels are seeking a starting pitcher. They are offering demoted center fielder Gary Pettis, unproven shortstop Gus Polidor and, possibly, 37-year-old Brian Downing, who has been reduced to platooning with Bill Buckner as the designated hitter now that the outfield has Johnny Ray in left, Devon White in center and Chili Davis in right.

The Dodgers are seeking a No. 1 shortstop and an established relief pitcher. They remain reluctant, in Claire’s words, to trade either Orel Hershiser or Bob Welch, their widely sought pitchers. The thinking seems to be: Why shatter the club’s one strength, the rotation of Hershiser, Welch, Fernando Valenzuela and Shawn Hillegas?

One Dodger official said: “All anyone talks about are Welch and Hershiser. That tells you what people think about our other players. If something is going to happen in Dallas it will have to come out of the blue because there’s nothing close to imminent. At this point it looks like Mariano Duncan is going to be our shortstop again.”

Duncan, recovering from knee surgery, is primarily playing second base in the Dominican Winter League. Claire said he has been encouraged by the reports, but Duncan apparently has to show more than physical stability. There seem to be lingering questions about his attitude and dedication.

“If we don’t make a trade, some positive things need to happen if we’re going to turn it around,” Claire acknowledged.

He added, however, that it’s conceivable the Dodgers may not be able to trade, that he didn’t regard it as mandatory and that he wouldn’t be forced into making a trade for the sake of trading or to satisfy the fans’ desires.

“If we trade, it will be only to benefit the team,” he said, adding that giving up Hershiser or Welch didn’t seem beneficial.

“I would term it doubtful,” he said of a possible deal involving either of those pitchers. “What we want to do is build around the strength of our starting pitching. We’re fortunate to have three proven starting pitchers and two youngsters (Hillegas and Matt Belcher) who pitched well in September. We’re also getting very positive reports on Tim Leary’s performance in the Mexican Winter League. (Leary is 5-0.) We regard it as encouraging.”

What are the Dodgers left to offer if Welch and Hershiser remain untouchable?

Leary’s winter record makes him a possibility, but Claire would not be more specific.

Others in the organization said that the late-season acquisition of second baseman Mike Sharperson or the continuing comeback of Duncan, providing the Dodgers acquire a shortstop, could leave Steve Sax vulnerable to trade or a move to the outfield, though Sax’s marketability is questionable because of his erratic defense.

Mike Marshall, they said, may also remain a candidate for trade, though his own marketability seems equally questionable because of a widely known susceptibility to injury and illness.

Claire said that Marshall and Pedro Guerrero, despite their antagonistic relationship, could play on the same team and that the problems of last season were behind them. He seemed to imply that he is as reluctant to deal Marshall or Guerrero as he is Welch or Hershiser.

He alluded to the Dodgers’ team batting average, low in the National League last season, and said:

“We need as much offense as we can get. I’m not ruling out anyone, but if you remove Marshall and Guerrero from the Dodger ballclub, you’ve removed two very large parts. I rate their value very highly.”

A surprising number of shortstops are said to be available, including the New York Mets’ Rafael Santana, the St. Louis Cardinals’ Jose Oquendo, the Cleveland Indians’ Julio Franco, the Oakland A’s Alfredo Griffin, the San Diego Padres’ Garry Templeton, the Angels’ Polidor, and the Atlanta Braves’ Rafael Ramirez and Andres Thomas.

Would any of them represent an improvement over what the Dodgers already have, or can the Dodgers provide what the respective club may want? In most cases, the answers seem to be no.

Welch, at this time, reportedly represents the price for Griffin, Franco, Oquendo or Santana. The Dodgers, according to a source, have already rejected an offer by the Mets of Santana, relief pitcher Jesse Orosco and outfielder Mookie Wilson for Welch. Claire’s talks with the Mets here could be worth monitoring, however.

New York is eager to make room for shortstop Kevin Elster and is said to be high on a Dodger pitching prospect named Ramon Martinez, who was 4-1 in the Florida State League.

A trade involving Santana and, perhaps, even Orosco could be reshaped to eliminate Welch.

Can the Dodgers find a relief pitcher if it’s not Orosco? They have already tried San Diego, according to a source, and been told that Lance McCullers is not available.

Claire said he was encouraged by the September relief work of Alejandro Pena, but Pena’s daily availability remains questionable because of his previous shoulder problems.

The Detroit Tigers would reportedly trade Willie Hernandez for Marshall, but Hernandez carries a $1-million price tag and bargain basement statistics.

The option may be free agency. The New York Yankees’ Dave Righetti and Houston Astros’ Dave Smith are both available, but their prospective salaries would not seem palatable to the budget-conscious Dodgers, who have long rejected free agency.

Claire refused to discuss Righetti and Smith and said only that free agency is an alternative that may take on greater significance if the Dodgers are unable to trade.

Meanwhile, the Angels are continuing their quest for a starting pitcher, but they are hardly alone.

“We’re like 88,000 others,” Port said, forcing a smile.

The release of Don Sutton, the continuing inability to re-sign free agent Mike Witt, who is known to be talking to the A’s, Philadelphia Phillies and Yankees among others, and the lingering uncertainty about Kirk McCaskill’s arm problems have left the Angels facing a potential crises on the mound.

Said Port: “I don’t want to make it sound like we’re the ’27 Yankees, but you go around our lineup, position by position, and I think you come away with a very favorable impression. What we need is pitching and pitching depth.”

There isn’t a lot available, but among some potential options are these:

--The San Francisco Giants are looking for a quality utility player and may be inclined to take Polidor for Kelly Downs.

--The Houston Astros and Pittsburgh Pirates are both interested in a shortstop and may be tempted by Polidor for Bob Knepper or Mike Bielecki.

--The Chicago White Sox, having already traded Rich Dotson to the Yankees, might still part with the high-salaried Floyd Bannister, but it would probably take Polidor as a platoon partner for Steve Lyons at third base, Pettis as a replacement for Kenny Williams in center, and maybe even Downing as a part time designated hitter and outfielder.

The Tigers’ Jack Morris, the Astros’ Danny Darwin and the Kansas City Royals’ Charlie Leibrandt are available free agents, but Port, having spent a second-round draft choice as compensation for the signing of free-agent Davis, said, “We don’t want to start eating up our young by signing a bunch of free agents.”

There is a better likelihood that Dan Petry, a former Placentia resident, will be returning to Orange County. The Tigers are not expected to offer him a contract, meaning that he eventually could be signed as an unrestricted free agent for considerably less than the $950,000 he made last year.

The Toronto Blue Jays are trying to unload the salary of pitcher Dave Stieb, but are said to want a front-line third baseman in return. The Blue Jays, however, are believed intrerested in Pettis as part of a plan that would move George Bell to designated hitter, Lloyd Moseby to left field and put Pettis in center. A source said that Toronto may part with Jeff Musselman, who was 12-5, or Jim Cerutti, who was 11-4, for Pettis.

There is no pressure, of course, on either Port or Claire to consummate a trade at the meetings. No longer do these affairs constitute a free-wheeling trading market. There were only 8 trades involving 29 players at last year’s gathering, only 13 involving 28 in 1985.

The free-agent situation and the complexities of today’s contracts have made it more difficult to trade. There is no longer a trading deadline tied to the end of the meetings, meaning teams can delay decisions until spring training or even later. In addition, the general managers now hold their own winter meetings in mid-November, diluting the significance of this annual convention. The ’87 meetings, in fact, could be over by Wednesday night rather than the customary Friday night.

Even so, there will be the usual rumors, and Claire, in particular, will be under scrutiny as he attends for the first time as Al Campanis’ successor. Campanis had a reputation for trying to get something for nothing, contributing to a feeling among many executives of Dodger arrogance. Some executives say that Claire has been trying to rebuild relations.

Claire said he hasn’t encountered any hostility.

“If anything it’s been just the opposite,” he said, smiling. “They seem very happy to deal with me. I’m the new kid on the block and they see their chance. It’s as if they’re saying, ‘Hey, let’s go talk to him.’ ”

The question is: Will it lead to anything more than talk?